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   Taking Your Team Spirit a Little Too Far

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Topic: Taking Your Team Spirit a Little Too Far (Read 1083 times)

Rhune
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Taking Your Team Spirit a Little Too Far
« on: Feb 2^nd, 2003, 1:10am »

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LEXINGTON, Ky. -- Some sports fans take their team spirit a bit too far. A surgeon who graduated from the University of Kentucky is being sued by Stephanie Means and her husband after he apparently used a cauterizing instrument to intentionally brand the letters "UK" on her uterus. Incriminating himself further, the doctor videotaped the operation and gave a copy to Means and her husband. The lawsuit says the tape clearly shows the doctor carving the letters into the woman's uterus. It looks like any of Means' future children will be University of Kentucky material.

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Kramer
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Re: Taking Your Team Spirit a Little Too Far
« Reply #1 on: Feb 2^nd, 2003, 9:32am »

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Wow, thats just plain sickening! :smash:

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chickmama
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Re: Taking Your Team Spirit a Little Too Far
« Reply #2 on: Feb 2^nd, 2003, 9:40am »

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OMG, that's awful. What could he have been thinking?...Ah! He obviously wasn't.

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MzWings
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Re: Taking Your Team Spirit a Little Too Far
« Reply #3 on: Feb 2^nd, 2003, 9:51am »

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Uh....I don't think there WILL be anymore children in the Means family. If I remember correctly ( :uhoh:

) Mrs. Means had a hysterectomy... "Marking" the uterus is standard practice.

From what I understood, a tiny hole or two is made in the abdomen and a camera inserted. A distinguishing "mark" is cauterized - not carved - on the uterus so that when it is delivered vaginally, the organ isn't twisted. That mark insures the surgeon a safe delivery.

As far as I can figure, the means are "sue happy". Shame.........

Just my :twocents:

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Kramer
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Re: Taking Your Team Spirit a Little Too Far
« Reply #4 on: Feb 2^nd, 2003, 6:52pm »

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OMG, the uterus is delivered vaginally? This is more than I ever want to know. Why cant they remove it surgically from the abdomen? I don't know anything about the process of a hysterectomy, so forgive my ignorance, but to make a lady deliver her uterus vaginally seems barbaric to me.

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Rhune
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Re: Taking Your Team Spirit a Little Too Far
« Reply #5 on: Feb 2^nd, 2003, 8:38pm »

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I had no idea it was done that way. I think fewer and fewer people have hystorectomies anymore because of modern science. I imagine the reason they do it vaginally is so that they don't have to leave huge scars on your abdomen. I seem to recall from when my mom had hers that you aren't awake at all during it, they put you fully under.

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MzWings
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Re: Taking Your Team Spirit a Little Too Far
« Reply #6 on: Feb 3^rd, 2003, 8:23am »

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on Feb 2^nd, 2003, 6:52pm, Kramer wrote:

Ewwww Krams! :rofl:

They don't "make" the woman deliver her uterus - the surgeon removes the organ that way rather than slice open the lower abdomen. It's a helluva lot simpler, faster surgery and recovery is a lot quicker too. And yes - the patient is under general anesthesia.

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Addams
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Re: Taking Your Team Spirit a Little Too Far
« Reply #7 on: Feb 3^rd, 2003, 11:58am »

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yep TMI for me. anything they do under general anesthesia - so long as they do their job properly and competently I don't need to know the specifics about. I didn't realize this either about a hysterectomy. I know that I should know - and thanks MzWings - LOL - I feel like a fully informed woman now. :yikes:

I do think that the doctor should have explained the marking part to the patient ahead of time - indeed the whole procedure. however the videotaping and marking with UK - went too far.

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MzWings
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Re: Taking Your Team Spirit a Little Too Far
« Reply #8 on: Feb 3^rd, 2003, 7:36pm »

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I'm really not sure what necessitates a patient presentation of a surgical video. Maybe he gives the patient the opportunity to have it if they want it. My last surgery (hopefully the last) was in '89 and a video wasn't an option back then.

I would imagine these are being done so that the surgeon can protect him/herself from a lawsuit. In my opinion, I don't feel this particular surgeon did anything wrong - given the marking situation. I think the Means are emotional and I think they took this to an attorney who jumped the gun to make a few bucks. And further, I feel the media jumped on the bandwagon for sensationalism. And lastly, I think this stinks.....

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Rhune
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Re: Taking Your Team Spirit a Little Too Far
« Reply #9 on: Feb 20^th, 2003, 9:46am »

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LEXINGTON, Kentucky (AP) -- Nine women are asking to join a lawsuit against a surgeon accused of branding the initials of his alma mater -- the University of Kentucky -- onto a patient's uterus during a hysterectomy.

The women -- including a former nurse of Dr. James M. Guiler -- say they discovered they had been similarly branded after watching videotapes Guiler had provided of their procedures.

"I didn't realize that he was doing this to everybody," said Dana Kelly, 41, a nurse who used to work in Guiler's office.

The original lawsuit was filed January 22 by Stephanie and David Means, who claim Guiler carved "UK" on Stephanie Means' uterus during her hysterectomy last August. She also had been given a videotape, and watched it after she experienced hemorrhaging following the surgery.

The nine women petitioned Fayette County Circuit Court on Wednesday to join the lawsuit, which asks for a jury trial. The lawsuit doesn't specify a dollar amount; the women are seeking punitive damages.

Guiler's attorney, Don Brown, said his client denies the procedure was inappropriate.

"We strongly deny any wrong-doing," he said.

Previously, Guiler defended the practice, saying the letters marked the organ's midline and distinguished its left and right side.

"Not only am I always able to remain oriented for the patient's safety, I felt this was honorable since it made reference to the college of medicine where I received my medical degree," he has said in a statement.

The women said they believe the uterine markings are unnecessary.

"As professionals, we all have standards we have to go by," said one of the women, Vickie Anderson, 38. "He crossed the line. It's chauvinistic, arrogant and shows a total disrespect for women."

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MzWings
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Re: Taking Your Team Spirit a Little Too Far
« Reply #10 on: Feb 21^st, 2003, 9:40am »

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Oh brother! To me, this is just another bunch of sue-happy people - period. For criminy sakes - would he have offered his patients a video if he had done something indiscriminate? As John Stossel says, "gimme a break." Undecided

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val9000
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Re: Taking Your Team Spirit a Little Too Far
« Reply #11 on: Feb 21^st, 2003, 11:06am »

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I live in Louisville, KY... about 45 minutes from Lexington. I also work for a local news radio station. This got much news coverage in this area and one fact seems to have been left out of the national news bits about it.

It is common practice for surgeon to "mark" the uterus during a hysterectomy. It's sorta like a signature... or avatar... or whatnot. Most surgeons use their initials... kinda like a painter "signing" his/her work.

Why? In addition to the reason MzWings mentioned about ensuring a "safe" and complete delivery (If the part with the mark comes out, the surgeon knows there are problems), the mark serves a second, equally important purpose. If the woman is ever under the knife again for any reason, be it the ER, outpatient or extended care, doctors can quickly identify that A) The woman has had a hysterectomy, and B) The operating surgeon can be quickly identified and consulted if there are complications which invovle the uterus.

The problem here is Guiler's way of explaining what goes on. He's done a woefully poor job of defending himself. Luckily for him, many other surgeons have more adequately explained the process to the media.

Of course, there is the question of why he doesn't just use his initals like everyone else. But does it really matter if he used JMG, UK or a smiley face? What he's guilty of is failing to properly explain WHY he uses UK instead of his initials.

Granted, I'm not a fan of the University of Kentucky, and would be a little miffed if I now had a UK logo etched on my uterus, but it's not something that will ever affect the way any part of my body works. It's certainly not suit-worthy.

My two cents:
Valerie

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Addams
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Re: Taking Your Team Spirit a Little Too Far
« Reply #12 on: Feb 21^st, 2003, 4:36pm »

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Hey I was in Louisville Kentucky! Had a lovely day in October 2001. Val9000 great to have you on the boards, I haven't had a chance to welcome you yet Cool

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MzWings
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Re: Taking Your Team Spirit a Little Too Far
« Reply #13 on: Feb 21^st, 2003, 9:00pm »

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Hey Val! Interesting points you've made. BUT! The uterus is marked so that it can be guided safely and completely, out of the cavity. The uterus itself, after some pathology is secured, is probably discarded/destroyed. I'm not understanding your statement about something left for any other physician to see or examine. As you stated - "the part with the mark" is on the uterus. The uterus is removed. Care to 'spain?

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luci
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Re: Taking Your Team Spirit a Little Too Far
« Reply #14 on: Mar 22^nd, 2003, 9:09am »

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Why not use the patient's initials or the hospitals?

He obviously used bad judgment, which may prove to be costly!

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